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Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:09 am
by Weatherhound
I am currently running the Enderle tunnel ram injected unit on top of my 540 BBC. I am planning to convert over to a blown alky set up so I am looking around for those that have "been there and done that" for any words of wisdom.

Thus far, this is what I know I have to do. Drop my CR down from 14.5 to a range around 9 to 11:1. Upgrade the 80A Enderle pump to a 100 series. Replace the camshaft to better suit forced induction. Upgrade the barrel valve to the blown alky application (or just change the spool?). I plan on using my current bird catcher hat. I also plan on removing the nozzle housing fittings from the ram and installing them in the injector hat and order the recommended nozzles from Enderle (along with the usual set of high speed pills). Order the distribution block and lines from Enderle to plumb the hat. I have a 3 way shut off valve and a high speed dump valve on the discharge of the pump, poppet type, which I am unsure if I will need that in blown service.

Upgrades to the bottom end will include getting all clearances to the recommended dimensions. I plan on keeping my steel H-beam rods w/ L19 cap screws, but if converting to aluminum rods is recommended I will follow that avenue. Additional ring end gap clearance, maybe o-ring the deck or heads.

I am running the CFE BMF cylinder head with 385cc intake port volume, 114cc chamber, stainless valves, standard seat alloy.

And now for the million dollar question...what manufacturer and type of blower? My goal is not to make 2500 HP. I want a nice reliable, lower maintenance engine package in the 1500 HP range that will run several seasons without stressing itself, kind of like the monster truck engines. If those blower motors and run over cars and RV's, jump 30 feet in the air, and do constant donuts for at least 90 seconds, then imagine how long one of those engines will last in a drag car?

I have been eyeballing TBS's billet housing racing blower (8-71 or 10-71). Of course, there is BDS, Weiand, Mooneyham, Littelfield, and several other reliable makers. I am not intersted in PSI, exotic Koblex, etc... that costs $5800 just for the huffer alone.

Lastly, is it recommended that the fuel pump be cam driven in blower applications? I am currently using the Gilmore belt on my 80A pump with the tunnel ram injector.

Thanks and best Regards,

Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:57 pm
by greenracing
Looks like you've got a lot pretty much figured out.

I think you'll just have to change the spool in the barrel valve. All the injection stuff - it's best just to talk to Enderle - they'll give you a good starting point.

You'll get a hundred different opinions on steel vs aluminum rods. Personally I think the aluminum rods are easier on bearings (gives more of a cushion), but I know several guys that are running steel and are not having any problems.

You definately want to o-ring the heads with a receiver groove in the block. If you're running aluminum heads, I'd put the wire in the heads. If you put the receiver in the heads, the aluminum is soft enough it will squoosh around over time and you'll loose the nice crisp receiver groove.

Make sure that you get your valve guide clearanced. I run 3 on the exhaust and 2 on the intake. If you don't loosen them up, you'll gall the stems and we all know what happens then.

As far as blower, If you're just going to make 1500 HP, which on that large an engine will be really easy, you don't need a really fancy blower. You could probably get by with an old used standard helix unit for pretty cheap. I made 1000HP with a 392 hemi running a non-stripped 6-71 turning 15% over.

I've known several people that are running belt driven fuel pumps. The cam drive units just remove another possible failure point.

You'll love the blower. Once you've had one, you'll never go back :lol:


Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 2:12 pm
by Weatherhound
Thanks Perry. Sometimes it's easy to lose focus and go over bore on what could be a simple project. My wife says I am famous for doing it.

I guess I will scour the classifieds all over in search for a blower set up. I typically prefer new equipment, especially if moving parts are involved.

And I will give Enderle a call on this as well.

Have a good one Perry.

Re: Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 4:21 am
by Weatherhound
Hey Perry,

Looks like I bit a pretty good piece of a project. Be careful in the future for all that choose a 0.400" longer rod for a short deck BBC engine. My 540 is going to have to have a short 1.120 compression height but I can get away with it because of running methanol, I can have as much as 12:1 on the compression ratio in a blown application. But because I have a short compression height, I don't have much meat on top of the piston which will limit how much HP I can make. I appears 1500 HP is about all I can generate using a flat top piston and a CR of a little more than 10:1 with such a short compression height. I am going to have to use a premium high end billet steel rod to have enough clearance on the small end of the rod. Callies is coming out with a new billet steel rod comparable to the Oliver rod. It will be available Feb. 15th 2010. Wiseco will be making my pistons and I should get them in 4 to 5 weeks. And then the BDS stage 4 8-71 will be next. I already have the goodies from Enderle to upgrade to blown application. This is going to be fun.

Re: Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:47 am
by greenracing
Sounds like you're getting a handle on it Brian!

I prefer little pistons myself. The Newberry combination we used to run in the truck had the pin up in the oil ring. I wanted to do the same with the Donovan, but I would have had to buy new everything and decided I'd save money and use what I had.

I'm only running 10:1 in mine right now and it's got plenty of bark. You can always make up for the static compression with more 'dynamic' compression ;)

Is the stage 4 a hi-helix blower?


Re: Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:01 pm
by Leon
Well, im going to tell ya. The first thing id do is get the comp to around 11.5.The less blower speed you use,the cooler it will run.Static gets you going,boost makes you go faster.If you dont have any static, it will leave like a dog,as boost really doesnt occur till 5000 rpms(yea i know,i know).If you have a high stall converter,like 5500 or more,its into boost and blows the tires off or breaks things.Id also use a nitro style valve as it has a saver port that the cube doesnt have which can be used as a secondary.You can use a bigger pump,but you will have to have a bigger loop. The most important thing is to have the system pressure between 125-150 lbs and keep it there under all conditions.Run hat nozzles only till you get he system dialed in, then put in ports,keeping the area the same.Bigger pumps will put out more pressure,but need to be set up accordingly.Keep the main as close to .100 as possible.You need a scroll that will close the return off quick enough on a blown app so it wont go lean on transition,that way you dont need the leak so high which cools the cylinders and also dilutes the oil.Setting the blower back also contributes to more even cylinder distribution. Run a good mag. Some people use cd ignitions,but a mag will keep it lit on the other end. You dont need to buy a new mag. I used a $200 vertex and had it hopped up with rare earth magnets and more windings along with a new drive to work on my hemi. Stock,1.3 amp-after mods 4.8.$850.New vertex,$1300

Re: Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 1:53 pm
by Weatherhound
Green, After much consideration I have in fact decided to go with a tall deck block and use a longer rod in the 6.700" range. I figure I would not need a larger blower with an already large displacement. My goal is to have this engine last a long time.

Leon, I had planned on 11:1 CR for the exact reason you mention. The boys down at TBS said the same thing. The converter is currently a 6000 flash, but I planned on running a tighter converter that will work in N2O applications as well. I will be using a nitro style BV (K style I believe) so I can relax on the transitions. The FP will be the 110 series from Enderle. I like the 135 psig range in pressure with a 105 jet (like I have now) with the injected application. The blower setting and outlet design is what ever TBS people advise me on. But what you said is what they mentioned. I was planning on staying CD on the ignition, but more and more are telling me a mag is the way to go. So I most likely will take that route.

For now, since I am having to get a new block, I plan on rebuilding my 540 and playing with it while building the blower motor.

Unexpected daughter wants a Jr dragster now so I plan on getting one in 2 weeks from a friend down the road that his daughter just transitioned to a car. For every $1000 shot in a different direction it slows my progress by 3 months. So this $4000 dragster just stopped me for a year. Ouch, but I love my daughter and she is completely worth it. My son will be of age in another year. I expect he will try his hand in one too.

Re: Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:04 pm
by Weatherhound
Perry, an update. I rebuilt my injector motor to race this season. I am completely making a new engine for the blower motor. Tall deck Dart Big M to get a 6.700 connecting rod in there, 10:1 CR, going with the Supercharger USA stage 4 8-71 unit. 540 CID. Still deciding on the rods. Callies just came out with a really nice set of premium steel rods comparable to Oliver but about $100 cheaper. And it looks like Erson or Bullet cams will make me the bump stick.

I spoke with Enderle about what all I needed and they certainly have me covered. Like you said, 1500 HP will be an easy tune for the 540. And the blower is deemed LOW maintenance, especially for my combination.

I should have done this a long time ago. LOL

Anyways, have a good racing season Perry.

Regards, Brian

Re: Tunnel Ram Injected to Blown Alcohol Conversion

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:09 pm
by greenracing
Sounds like you've got it figured out Brian!

Have fun racing Jr's. I've managed to sidestep my kids requests for a Jr. I told them we had enough problems keeping one car running, we didn't need another :roll: